Our view on border security »
Posted by: STONERS 1 month, 2 weeks agoNext time you're inching toward the Customs inspector at an airport or the Mexican or Canadian border, consider not just what's in your suitcase or your pockets, but what's in your laptop, cellphone or your digital camera.
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STONERS1 month, 2 weeks ago
"How often does this happen? The numbers are murky. Out of more than 400 million travelers last year, the Department of Homeland Security says that some 250,000 had "baggage violations," a catchall category for everything from contraband or laptop searches. The Association of Corporate Travel Executives surveyed its members this month and found that seven of the 91 (7.7%) who responded said they have had a laptop, BlackBerry or other device searched or seized at Customs."
"Most Americans would probably endorse the objective: to catch terrorists, child pornographers or other criminals, and officials trumpet the instances in which they've caught just such people after finding incriminating material on their computers."
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STONERS1 month, 2 weeks ago
"Perhaps, but most people consider laptops extensions of their homes and offices, not mere containers. Rifling without focus through people's files is hardly the equivalent of searching for drugs or other contraband being brought illegally into the country. And even if the searches are legal, the mystery surrounding them is troubling. Among the unanswered questions: Whose laptops are getting searched? What are the rules for holding your property? What happens to data once it's copied into government computers? "
"At a recent congressional hearing, Homeland Security sent only written testimony with vague assurances about these issues. Secretary Michael Chertoff repeats some of the same assurances below, but they boil down to "trust us." That's not good enough."
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Justice4All1 month, 1 week ago
Many companies have warned people to be carful about sensitive company information on computers. We have been advised that out laptops can be searched when arriving or departing the US. In fact many meetings that should be held in the US are now held outside the US to avoid these types of problems. More money sent overseas.
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STONERS1 month, 2 weeks ago
I don't trust none of them either... And you are welcome texangelwings...
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Aidenag1 month, 2 weeks ago
Thats the largest concern in regards to this, trade secrets. Imagine your going to say google with a source code worth millions.. Would you trust Customs/ the US govt, to keep it safe, or not use it for themselves?
And if you encrypt your files to protect them(like most biz people do when traveling with sensitive info) I have heard that it pretty much guarantee's that your laptop is getting confiscated.
We really have become a police state with all these big brother type laws and regulations making us more like cattle to our masters, than free people living in a free society.
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Charlson1 month, 2 weeks ago
"At a recent congressional hearing, Homeland Security sent only written testimony with vague assurances about these issues. Secretary Michael Chertoff repeats some of the same assurances below, but they boil down to "trust us." That's not good enough.
The rules for confiscating devices and safeguarding data should be explicit and public, and independent oversight is needed to ensure that downloaded data are handled properly. Until that happens, the policy seems to be one of traveler, beware."
We've heared that refrain, "trust us", too many times the last 7 years. How about, "trust, but verify"?
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Dicax_Maximus1 month, 2 weeks ago
Last time I travelled to the US, I backed up my laptop's company sensitive data to an external company drive (on one of their EU based servers), deleted it ALL from my laptop, and then had some fun with the "nice" people at Chicago's airport....
Question asked (politely) :- Why I was travelling with my laptop.... (It was at this point I realised I was dealing with a mentally challenged person)....
Answer :- I need it for my work.
Question :- Please show me your work.
Answer :- Sorry, I can't do that, as it's not stored on this device.
Question :- Can you show me the device it's stored on ?
Answer :- Er, no. As said device is in Europe, we are in the US and unless I'm MUCH mistaken, you do not have an ethernet port here !
Response :- Sir, this is an airport, not an etherport......
I was a tad fortunate in that a supervisor (who had a brain) arrived at that moment......
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nikkibabe1 month, 2 weeks ago
This is a nation of immigrants. Everyone who wants to come here for a better life should be allowed.
If you don't want it, then demolish that Statue of Liberty and send it back to France.
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DanmLiberals1 month, 2 weeks ago
It's also a nation of laws and if you don't want to follow them then you shouldn't be allowed in the first place. There is a difference between coming legally and illegally. Can you spot the difference Nicki? Go back to your socialist homeland Nicki and tell me how many immigrants they allow their.
Regarding the arcticle I carry my laptop everywhere when I travel. Been to Asia, South America, Europe and I have never been searched. I am guessing that they are profiling and even if I have to wait a little longer in line, I feel a wee bit safer on the plane.
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SwampFox-82nd1 month, 1 week ago
PS: DamnnedLiberals, you aren't worth the space within our society for your kind. Every time you open that hole between your ear lobes, you prove to the world just how worthless you really are...
All you've stated is you have a job, that's really kind of you. And you don't care if civilization rots, so long as you have that job.
And for the record, if you are that ignorant there are no words that will save your sorry neocom ass.
Define travel, my fellow American. Speak of all those hassles you confront daily. Then get that sorry-ass up and find the truth. Who do you think brought all this to bear?
Knowing you, you can't wait to find blame ANYWHERE else but within truth.
PS: And when you become unemployed you too can espouse the beautiful Republican party, ad nauseum.
And if aren't getting a penny profit for all that garbage, you are stupider than I have even given you credit for.
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lvrofwolves1 month, 1 week ago
A year and a half ago we went to Europe, we took our laptops, cell phones, digital cameras and video cams, we weren't searched once. We've driven up to Canada every year for the last 4 yrs and will again in Sept, we've never once had a problem there at the border either...hopefully I'm not jinxing myself for it to happen this time, but if it does, I don't feel I should complain. These are pleasure trips and I would probably feel much different if they were business related, especially if they did look into my personal things, laptop-cameras etc....but I guess I expect border patrol to be diligent as far as security. when traveling to another country everyone should follow all the rules of that country, regardless if they agree with the rules or not. If you are a frequent traveler be it pleasure or business you should always be prepared for border crossing.
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SwampFox-82nd1 month, 1 week ago
Amen, Nikki. May I suggest a reason for your less-than-welcomed post? Yes, my cool friend, mankind immigrated from their birth-place; that's why we are all here, and not there. This issue of placing blame falls far short of the guilty. Has anyone finally figured out what NAFTA really meant? Reagan wanted to break the unions, and NAFTA was the conduit of everyone of those new immigrants. They would love one-half of what union pays their constituents. They needed no health-care, they needed no over-time, all they needed was a job. That's the other-side of this "wealthy" society.
I'm retiring in Paris, I think the French will know how to handle that our words are nothing but garbage. Today, you must have mega-bucks to become a citizen of this great land of lies and broken words...
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lvrofwolves1 month, 1 week ago
I totally disagree that our borders should be completely open for a free for all. when this country truly was a nation of immigrants, they worked their butts off to make America what it is today, with no help programs that we have today, and they also followed American laws and rules. If they cannot or will not follow our laws, I do not want them here. I have total respect for anyone from anywhere wanting to become American and following the rules to do that.
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humemacdonald1 month, 1 week ago
lvrofwolves,
I agree that a free for all at the border is not a wise decision, but at the same time it would help matters if border regulations were more not so stringent. Faced with little to no chance of obtaining citizenship without being wealthy or an elite, most are willing to risk sneaking in.
Here in Canada with $200,000 cash you can buy your way in. Is this $200,000 any guarantee that this is a person that I want living in my country, no; they could be an drug dealer for all I know. What about the hardworking teacher who may want to immigrate?
I used to volunteer as an ESL tutor, and one of the ladies I helped spent almost 15 years in a refugee camp ( her whole family was killed) before she was accepted into Canada.
It is not like we don't have any room up here. We have a declining population and we need immigrants. Historically, times of increased immigration have also seen positive economic gains as well. Immigration has in the past been good for the economy.
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NoSpinDave1 month, 1 week ago
"This is a nation of immigrants. Everyone who wants to come here for a better life should be allowed.
If you don't want it, then demolish that Statue of Liberty and send it back to France."
Whats your point? No one has a problem with people who want to come here LEGALLY and go through the LEGAL process to become a citizen. My wife is from Argentina and has waited several years and spent thousands of dollars to go through the process the LEGAL/RIGHT way, so I can say we have put our "money where our mouth is" on this issue.
Please dont confuse legal immigration with CRIMINAL TRESPASSING.
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ZippySpincycle1 month, 1 week ago
Sigh...Hey, thanks, everybody, for seeing only the words "border security" in the headline and turning this thread into an opportunity to rant, yet again, on various sides of the immigration debate.
The article is about DHS's questionable tactics in examining travelers' belongings, in particular the data on their laptops, in a manner that, were these searches done anywhere else, would require a search warrant.
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NoSpinDave1 month, 1 week ago
"the Department of Homeland Security is a Nazi organization."
More proof liberals have overused the word Nazi to the point where it has lost its meaning. Very sad and only serves to lessen the memory of the crimes the REAL NAZI'S committed against the Jewish people.
If homeland security starts throwing illegal immigrants into ovens and cooking them ALIVE, or maybe making lampshades out of their skin, then....AND ONLY THEN...can you start calling them NAZI's.
The fact that you could get 5 pos votes for that IDIOTIC comment speaks VOLUMES about how far off the deep end some of the left wing extremists here have fallen.
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lvrofwolves1 month, 1 week ago
Even tho I haven't been treated in such a manner, I do think it would seem very intimidating, most that I have seen the border security isn't like it used to be, smiles and welcomes and you knew they were there for your safety,not against you, but for you, now it's you best march right, don't step out of line, don't complain (at least loudly) do not make any moves that may seem threatening etc....
You do realize NoSpinDave that a good portion of nazis did not participate in the ovens, lampshade making, herding people to their death etc...tho still they were all of the same organization. The nazi thought process was the same.
SHOW ME YOUR PAPERS and by GOD they better be correct!
Even the DMV seems 'nazi' like at times, it's the control they have over others, and just because I haven't been subject to it, I know many people who have and I'm probably due for a run in....
I kinda understand why on one hand, but some do go overboard with the power.
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reviewer1 month, 2 weeks ago
With the rapid decline of the airlines, we may not have to worry about some of these problems much longer.
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Folopiuyt1 month, 2 weeks ago
I'm with you on that, what exactly are they protecting us from by going through our private data? Data never hurt anyone, has it? Are we not allowed to keep any trade secrets if we travel abroad?
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Clarksville221 month, 2 weeks ago
I don't trust them! Not one ounce!
Perhaps they need to focus more on the land and spaces between the check points as to who is entering our country!
Thanks STONERS! Good article!
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HMMace1 month, 1 week ago
THAT STATUE OF LIBERTY IS THAT WE ARE A FREE COUNTRY...WE CAN NOT AFFORD TO REAR ALL THE WORLDS
CHILDREN...
ALSO--WE DO NOT OWE THE WORLD OUR WELFARE..OR OUR SOCIAL SECURITY...
WE WELCOME IMMIGRANTS--ITS THE ILLEGALS WE WILL DEPORT IN A NEW YORK MINUTE..WHEN YOU SNEAK IN--YOU BECOME A FELON..THAT IS OUR LAW..
WHAT WE SHOULD DO IS ENACT MEXICOS LAWS..--OF COURSE--IF YOU DO NOT LIKE IT HERE--THAT DOOR IS ALWAYS OPEN FOR YOU TO LEAVE..
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sumptuousdigs1 month, 1 week ago
It certainly is a breach of one's privacy isn't it? Not only can you be stripped and X-rayed, you are in effect mind scanned too.
Earlier this year I was detained by customs and immigration authorities in Toronto, Canada. I was flagged by an intelus report showing some old issues from about ten years ago. I've got a past. This of course gave them cause to comb through my laptop. My John & Yoko type picture (2 Virgins) of me and my girlfriend was smiling back at them at one point. I told the officer that I intended to return to Canada, as I have always enjoyed their beautiful country. He said, "And our beautiful women". I just grinned.
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humemacdonald1 month, 1 week ago
John and Yoko, eh? hmmm... you learn something new everyday.
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joeblowe1 month, 1 week ago
In the case of a U.S. citizen RETURNING to the U.S., it seems to me that the 4th and 5th Amendments would apply. Entering a FOREIGN country is less clear as you would be governed by THEIR laws I presume. I would suggest in any case that you never, ever, carry anything that would be considered a serious loss if it were to be confiscated. You just never know what some knucklehead border guard is going to do. (This applies especially if you have a beard or a slightly dark complexion) I've personally never had any problems with any customs or border guards, but then again ... I don't look like a criminal or terrorist either. It probably also helps that I am NOT either of those things... {;>D)=
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ZippySpincycle1 month, 1 week ago
Among the worst aspects of this policy is that, in addition to seriously bending our 4th amendment protections against unreasonable searches, it isn't really making anyone the least bit safer--searching travelers' laptops is extremely unlikely to find any terrorists or child pornographers, but it does a dandy job of making everyone afraid. This is a prime example of what Bruce Schneier has termed Security Theater: "security countermeasures intended to provide the feeling of improved security while doing little or nothing to actually improve security." There's a good overview at Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security_theater
Even better is Schneier's blog, http://schneier.com/blog/
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sumptuousdigs1 month, 1 week ago
Canada has beefed up their immigration criteria, as I have afore mentioned. It is the U S's job to watch it's (U S) entrance. 9/11 isn't the first time people bent on the overthrow of the U S Government crossed the border bent on carrying out a desperate plan. Raiders crossed into Vermont from across the Canadian border, and held an entire town hostage, robbed the bank, and burned a few buildings. It was a terror raid, launched to show the Federal Government (and the American people) that the Confederate States of America could strike at will!
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