News – "I am not here for political reasons. I'm not a politician. ... I'm not running for the Oval Office. I've been running for Jesus for a long, long time and I'm not tired yet," he said to laughter and cheers.
TimALoftis: The link for this story has been redirected to the original source story. Please avoid breaking the middleman rule.
2008-04-27 21:13:53
Rev. Wright continues in the path of others like Rev. Sharpton and Rev Jackson. He spreads discord against whites as an excuse for lack of success. I seem to have missed the talk about social responsibility. I hear nothing about crime. I hear nothing about children without any male members of the family. I hear nothing about respect. How does this show that someone that listens to this for 20 years can be a leader of everyone?
Are you too stupid, too stubborn, or just too racist to see that the issues of which you speak, kboy, are not issues of race. They are issues of income. In the U.S. income is a result of ambition, talent and to a very large degree opportunity.
Play the race card. It avoids the trouble of actually discussing the issues by conveniently demonizing someone with a different opinion.
Dropkick, it is not us that come on this thread to talk about anything other than the article, it is people like you who want to talk about Wright's sermons from 20 years ago or how he affects Obama. You are emphasizing difference. You contend, as I have already exposed you doing in most all of your posts, that difference is deficient. Therefore, it is you who is trying demonize the black church and one of its leaders, Rev. Wright.
Its more complicated than that. Blacks were not enslaved after the civil war but were second class citizens up until the sixties. At least legally and socially they were treated as such. Unlike Mexicans who come accross the border from a cohesive culture, blacks were brought here against their will and had no social support system in place. Among caucasions, if one member of a group fails, he might have an uncle, or a brother or a friend, who has a connection to help him find a job. Blacks in this country don't have this sort of social infrastructure. Much of success in this country is as much about who you know as what you know. If you are black and middle class, and you begin to have economic problems, chances are, you're on your own.
Many whites just don't appreciate the way this culture caters to them and how much this helps. If you encounter suspicion and distrust everywhere you go because you are black, you start out having to overcome a cultural bias to get ahead.
I think you need to read a book called "How the Irish Became White" by Noel Ignatiev or "The Jungle" by Upton Sinclair.
Irish SLAVES in America were treated worse then their black counter parts because "An Irishman costs less"
Polish immigrants worked 20 hour days, 7 days a week making very little money, basically slaves. Then they were stuffed in rooms with other families no bigger then the average living room, just to get by.
I also love how people always seem to forget how man free blacks owned black slaves of their own:
http://americancivilwar.com/authors/black_slave...
"In New Orleans over 3,000 free Negroes owned slaves, or 28 percent of the free Negroes in that city.
To return to the census figures quoted above, this 28 percent is certainly impressive when compared to less than 1.4 percent of all American whites and less than 4.8 percent of southern whites."
newbie0420 - um WHAT? Is this guy for real? What is less than FREE? you need to let your hem out your ignorance slip is showing! I hear this about the Irish all the time The Irish are White You don't have a problem with white.
What is the relevance here, what is your point? Are these blacks just making more of this darn slave thing than need be made? Do you have any idea how stupid your post is?
"I also love how people always seem to forget how man free blacks owned black slaves of their own:"
Fred blacks didn't own slaves, how could they. it was against the law!
I take it in your ignorance you didn't even bother following my link:
According to federal census reports, on June 1, 1860 there were nearly 4.5 million Negroes in the United States, with fewer than four million of them living in the southern slaveholding states. Of the blacks residing in the South, 261,988 were not slaves. Of this number, 10,689 lived in New Orleans. The country's leading African American historian, Duke University professor John Hope Franklin, records that in New Orleans over 3,000 free Negroes owned slaves, or 28 percent of the free Negroes in that city.
Interesting newbie... Black people also discriminate among themselves. Country or tribe of origin may have produced the dramatic results Ignatiev claims during Civil War times - but I see no lingering signs of any desire among Afro Americans to perpetuate that past. Whatever history might have been has long since been outstripped by civil rights issues that involve not only Black people but other visible and non-visible minorities also.
You are missing a key point. Visibility. An Irishman only stands out as an Irishman if he has an accent or if his name is very Irish sounding. After a few generations, his heirs will blend more fully into the white establishment.
Who cares how many slaves blacks owned? What is your point? That it was okay for whites to own slaves because blacks did? Or blacks are degenerates for enslaving their own people? I how this relates to or detracts from the validity of my point. The tone of your post is that blacks are inferior to whites and they are soley responsible for their lower social and economic status in America. I am not suggesting that blacks have no responsibility for their own welfare but I also believe it would be naive to suggest that the playing field is level or that their aren't structural impediments. It isn't. Whites have dominated the culture here for the last 250 years. Blacks have only enjoyed equal legal status within our life time.
Hanyman -Well said I have said this for years but it falls on dumb ears, coming from a white man maybe others will take the time to listen and understand.
Thanks, but sadly I doubt that most prejudices can be overcome. Among conservatives, there is a need to exploit and perpetuate the angry white man myths in order to set the working classes against each other. Its an industry of sorts. By appealing to peoples baser instincts, you can generate cover and support for an agenda that would not be palatable otherwise.
The best way to overcome racism in America, in my opinion, is addressing economic ills. We must finish what begain in the late sixties. Lyndon Johnson had it right with the great society, but those noble efforts were undermined and cut short by the war in Vietnam and a cultural backlash that sprang up in response to general perception that lawlessness and moral decay were on the rise. Many of the ideas of the Great society were naive but failure of the war on poverty was not a forgone conclusion in my opinion but an unfortunate combination of events and the forces of reaction.
kboy, if you would take the time to listen to the thousands of sermons the Rev. Wright has preached, you would have heard all those pet themes of yours, but he was addressing the NAACP on "Change" and he thinks people like you, who emphasize "children without any male member of the family" who think that happens only in black culture, sees that being different is deficient. Obviously, from your post, you do see a deficiency. Therefore, the Rev. Wright is right about your kind hating and attacking the black church. You, sir, are a racist and white supremist because of your stance on such. You do think difference is deficient.
Good thing I'm not Italian or I'd be looking down my garlic nose at "Reverend" Wright....
Heck, you probably don't even know any Italians, or you'd have known better than to make that "garlic nose" comment.
You talking to me or Rev. Wright....
"You must feel that he is deficient, because if you were Italian, "you would be LOOKING DOWN my garlic nose at..." Thanks for proving his point."
Nice attempt at putting words in my mouth throughout your entire post, but IF I were Italian I'd only be looking down my garlic nose at him AFTER he made his RACIST comments about Italians.
Just like I look down on anybody who makes racist comments.
I love different, I'm currently dating a Muslim woman, I have numerous black/latino/asian friends.
I just went to Jamaica with a Mexican and Puerto Rican.
Rev Wright is a different kind of black pastor then I've ever met because he's an ignorant racist, which makes him deficient at what he does.
I just simply copied your words an repasted them. How is that putting words in your mouth? LOL
"I love different, I'm currently dating a Muslim woman, I have numerous black/latino/asian friends." Now, newbie, that is real white of you. LOL
"Rev Wright is a different kind of black pastor then I've ever met because he's an ignorant racist, which makes him deficient at what he does." LOL Thanks again for proving his point. You are attacking the black church. Why do you insist on Wright being racist when there is no evidence of such? Where is your documented evidence he is a racist? Please continue to comment.
K, one listens to a lot of stuff in our media-saturated culture without--one devoutly hopes--taking it all as gospel (pun, etc.).
Not the best move for a pol aspiring to high elected office not to have been cannier about disassociating himself from Wright earlier.
But now Obama has done so. Those for whom his relationship with Wright is a deal-breaker have the option not to vote for Obama (whom they probably wouldn't have supported anyway).
Others may consider the relationship unfortunate but not, ultimately, determinative in re supporting O.
I would council not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Of course, there are an awful lot of us that DON'T BELIEVE THE HYPE, and agree with Rev. Wright's words, and understand what blacks, other minorities, and the poor of all races have been up against in the US for the last hundred years. I not only understand exactly what he meant when he said what he did, I agree one hundred percent. Take the word black out of his sermons and he is right on for all of us.
He rails against blacks falling for the politics of division. And they are using these words to divide blacks and whites RIGHT NOW. I beg you all not to fall for this ruse.
"Those for whom his relationship with Wright is a deal-breaker have the option not to vote for Obama (whom they probably wouldn't have supported anyway). "
And most of those who are bringing this up during the Democratic Primary season have an interest in either prolonging the fight, or they want a Clinton/MaCain matchup in the fall.
I just watched Wright on Fox answering questions at the National Press Club.
He just blew Obama out of the water.
Hillary must be thrilled. Talk about toast ...
I am sorry, Simon, did we watch the same National Press Club interview or did one of us listen too long to the Fox pundits?
I don't think Obama was hurt one bit by anything he said. It is really not about Obama, it is about whites attacking the black church like he said. Obama has aleady distanced himself from Wright and Wright, in my opinion, further distanced himself from Obama. Obama is a politician, and Wright is a pastor. Both view and handle their lives accordingly, so, what is new? I doubt he is toast. Just watch the polls the next few days. This is just getting fun. Obama will either kick ass or lose.
Then I suppose Hillary is upset and discouraged by what is happening ...
Hillary is just doing what Hillary must to avoid getting KO'd by a dark horse.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/column...
Some pretty picture eh? If she pulls off the nomination it'll be because she has acquired Lewinsky's taste for ... I'll leave the rest to your imagination...
in private, probably would be my guess, but I think she is probably trying to figure angles to use negative ad campaigns against him. What Hillary is upset about is the fact, despite Wright, she keep losing grounds in the polls. She has slipped from a 9 point lead in Indiana to now behind as much as 9 points. She lost 11 points the last two weeks of Pa despite the "bitter" and Wright controversies. So, you tell me what you think about how she feels. Personally, I hope she just keeps attacking. It seems to be back firing pretty good. She cannot catch him in the direction she is now heading. I am laughing my ass off at all the people who are attacking Wright, Obama and black churches. Obama keep soaring in the polls. Keep turning us voters off, guys. LOL
I can certainly understand why the Obamas stayed in Rev. Wright's church for 20 years. He is a gifted and powerful speaker. And he uses that speaking ability to try to point out inequities within the US and in our foreign policy -- places where we as a country stray from the message of Christ.
Sad to say that DropkickaLib's hate filled slurs fall far short of the man he hopes to malign.
Yes ET but this is the problems GOPers have with LIBS we point out our countries fault because we expect her to be better, they cant get that. We know she can do and be better than they have made her in the last 7 years, they are against anyone that says she is in bad shape because, well they put her in that bad shape. Like Rev Wright, I love my country and cant stand to see what these fools have done to her in the name of green and any real American would be mad as hell over the state she is in!
Best Wright quote of the whole event, "Please tell my stuck-on-stupid friends that Arabic is a language, it's not a religion. Barack Hussein Obama. Barack Hussein Obama. Barack Hussein Obama. There are Arabic-speaking Christians, Arabic-speaking Jews, Arabic-speaking Muslims and Arabic-speaking atheists. Stop trying to scare folks by giving them an Arabic name as if it's some sort of diseaseâ;¦Did you hear me, O'Reilly?"
Believe it or not some people won't vote for Obama because his middle-name is Hussein. What jamokes!
And Grr, above, page 3 (of the Con playbook) is "call them antisemitic"...., as in, all libs are.
No, page 3 is call them "pacifists".
Page 4 is where you substitute "antisemitic" for "antizionist" at every opportunity.
I thought page 3 was 'Marxist'...
Where did you get the play book? Who taught you the secret handshake?!
It's obviously no secret - not any more. Now we have a few different editions - the Tyndale playbook being considered out of date - and the modern internet obviously allowing for more flexibilty. Even so - the message in the playbook is essentially the same as always. People like Voltaire, Twain, Bierce and even Lewis Carroll understood it quite well and satirized its contents. Whose white roses do you want painted red today? There's always a Rove or Kristol around to do the fancy work and always a Twain to undo it afterwards. Kudos to the Twains on this and all other Propellor treads.
There are folks in the Obama campaign who in their heart of hearts want the "good" Reverend to vanish until after Election Day
But he won't.
God bless him! ;-)
Thanks for the blessing SJ. I agree, Wright was right on target. I think, despite the NeoCon media pundits glee, this will help Obama in the long run. Wright spoke nothing but the truth. I hope he keeps on keeping on. So, do you agree or disagree with what he said? That there are people who think that difference is deficient, and it is those people who are attacking the black church, and in particular, this leader of a black church?
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Yeah - how about that!
Yesterday someone posted an url on another thread and it was THE MOST FUNDAMENTAL indictment of the kind of institutionalized racism we have grown up with and been nurtured in over literally centuries of cultivated discriminatory policy making and "colloquial" acceptance. Here it is again.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_Ham