4 shot outside Colorado Springs church »
Posted By sencha11 1 year, 1 month ago in NewsA gunman opened fire in the parking lot of a Colorado Springs church on Sunday, striking four people, the church's pastor said.
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slate1 year, 1 month ago
Sad thing for such a thing to happen,,, it appears that there was another attack south of the first one.
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tanglang1 year, 1 month ago
Let us pray that the suspect(s) will be found quickly before they can kill/harm anyone else.
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marshx1 year ago
probably not, on the news they say they believe its the same shooter at both locations. he'd been refused a place at the hotel, so he shot the 2 receptionists. SAD..
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vettenut1 year ago
Nice attempt at trying to "muddy the waters" with irrelevant details, aidenag.
It's quite likely that the phase of the moon was more of a contributing factor, than the spectre of a former and disgraced leader.....
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Aidenag1 year ago
These two shootings definitely seem connected. I wonder if the fact this second shooting was Ted Haggard's old church has anything to do with it.
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slate1 year ago
I guess we'll find that out,,, I suppose if you have an ax to grind Ted's place would be a well known one to get that message out,,,
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skeek1 year ago
This week it's the standard combination of religion, hypocrisy and sexual repression. Last week it was teenage angst and self-loathing. The week before it was what? Alienation and psychosis? Apart from all of these being various manifestations that have erupted from the same culture, the common factor in all of them was men with guns. I know how you Americans worship and revere your guns, but as it is often the solution you apply to so many problems, from global politics to personal inadequacies, have you ever considered that the source of these problems may just reside within this dangerous obsession?
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dissent1 year ago
Sure but a gun just makes it soooooooo easy you don't even have to give it a second thought, just squeeeeeeze.
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skeek1 year ago
Most times the person is dead before they can be properly blamed but that does nothing to bring back their victims. It achieves nothing except to ease your conscience and it gives you a way out of having to think much more about it. Your excuse is a rationale you apply after the fact for your own benefit. Your solution is to simply shrug your shoulders and say that's what people do. Personally, I'm a great believer in prevention rather than cure. You offer neither.
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rockman0691 year ago
Unfortunately that is not always the case.
Care to view what NJ thinks?
http://donoevil.propeller.com/story/2007/12/10/...
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Justice4All1 year ago
There are a lot of things that happen in China that you will never read about or see on TV.
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DeadXXXManXXXTalkin1 year ago
chris rock:
'whatever happened to crazy? Ain't nobady crazy no more?'
you can point at sicial factors all you want, but social factors don't pull triggers.
what about the other 99.99% that never shot anybody?
what are you gonna blame their good behavior on, seeing as they are part of the same society and culture?
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slate1 year ago
Cuz it's easier to just blame America for everything?
Yeah there are crazy people everywhere,,, didn't a crazy group set of chemical weapons in Japan? What are the gun laws like there?
Didn't someone kill someone in one of the Scandinavian countries kill a descendant of a famous painter? What are the gun laws like there?
Let's also talk about bus bombings in the UK and riots in France while we are at it.
Yeah blaming America is very easy to do; it makes not having to look at crazy people in your own neck of the woods easier as well.
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tanglang1 year ago
The fact that you said my comment was not origional would lead one to believe that I am not the first person who has said you are a man hater. Thanks for that.
And most child murders are carried out by women. Do you blame them for that? Actually, I don't believe that men commit more murders. Have American men really murdered more than 40 million people in the last 30 years?
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skeek1 year ago
You are obviously incoherent and incapable of reading three simple sentences. I called you banal, shallow and gob-smackingly ignorant. I did not call you unoriginal, something that is neither here nor there but it seems to matter to your brittle ego.
As for the facts, here I've done your homework for you, taken from your own justice dept website.
"Males were almost 10 times more likely than females to commit murder in 2005"
http://www.ojp.gov/bjs/homicide/gender.htm
Most people would realise their stupidity by now but I doubt that you have. Let me guess, you're going to say 2005 was an aberration.
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tanglang1 year ago
Main Entry: ba·nal
Pronunciation: bÉ;-Ë;nal, ba-, -Ë;näl; bÄ;-Ë;nal; Ë;bÄ;-nÉ;l
Function: adjective
Etymology: French, from Middle French, of compulsory feudal service, possessed in common, commonplace, from ban
Date: 1825
: lacking originality, freshness, or novelty : trite
Now who is incoherent?
Nope. I'm going to say that abortion is murder and 40 million babies have been murdered by women in the last thrity years.
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skeek1 year ago
So you didn't bother with the US Department of Justice quote "Males were almost 10 times more likely than females to commit murder in 2005" and attempt to dispute it as it blatantly contradicts what you have said, but went to a dictionary instead to pedantically try and score a cheap, meaningless point. Good one. Now THAT really is banal bordering on anal.
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skeek1 year ago
Uh huh. That's something you need to take up with the statisticians at your department of justice.
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tanglang1 year ago
If you would like to continue tomorrrow, col. But 5am eastern comes early. Goodnight skeek.
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DeadXXXManXXXTalkin1 year ago
just so you know that made no sense and was a lame retort
what does it even mean?
the remaining 99.99% will make the headlines for violent crimes?
you were better off leaving the comment alone and recognizing the point made
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oldgringo1 year ago
skeek...way to work in your usual anti-American rant!Your so creative (for an Aussie)! By the way, how do you explain all of the thefts, rapes and senseless murders in your beloved homeland. No hypocrisy, sexual repression, alienation,teenage angst or psychosis down there, huh? YOU are an expert on hypocrisy!
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skeek1 year ago
Read my bio, old fart. Pay careful attention to how I am anti-nationalist so I'll be the first to take shots at Australia. The Aussie dig is water off a duck's back to me. But since it's the only angle you've got let's take it a little further shall we? When was the last time you read of some psycho in Australia stomping around like Arnie (ie. engrained in your culture) blowing people away just because he's had a bad day? Uh huh, more than a decade ago after which gun control was introduced. Up until then serial shootings happened maybe once a year, if that. But in your country it happens, well, what time is it? But the pure b*llshit a few of the posters above come up with so that they don't have to give up their precious guns for a safer, saner society never ceases to amaze me. No, for people such as ChiefEOD, they blame the individual and carry on as if nothing happened. Great solution, Chief, I'll bet you can all rest easy now that you've figured that much out. Pure genius.
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tanglang1 year ago
Your bio says that you are a citizen of the world. What a cop-out. I am an American, and damn proud to be one!
Giving up guns would bring about a "safer, saner society"? Now that's some bullsht. You know what our fore-fathers would have done without their guns? Nothing. We would still be a province of GB and would be taxed to death. We would not have any freedoms. Even more recent, what would the slaves have done without guns? Nothing. They would still be slaves. Take Kennesaw Ga, where I live. We have a law that says you cannot live here without owning a gun. We also have one of the lowest crime rates in the nation. I guess that means nothing to you though.
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tanglang1 year ago
Why not blame the person? If I take a knife and stab you, is it my fault, or the knifes? What if I were to run someone down with my car? Would you then say that cars should be banned for a safer, saner society? Baseball bats? Hockey sticks? Where is the line? At what point do you take some responsibility for your actions? At what point do we hold People accountable?
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skeek1 year ago
Of course it's your fault. But as serial shootings happen every few days in your country it beoomes a statistic. That statistic becomes data from which many things can be determined, one of which is, as pointed out to you above by your own justice dept, that men are 10 times more likely to commit murder than women. Another is that it happens every few days in your country! Care to ask yourself why or have I been going too fast for you?
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skeek1 year ago
As for the knife and gun comparison. Knives can kill but they often serve other purposes, such as cutting rope, opening letters, slicing bread and even buttering bread, just to name a few. Some knives serve only one purpose, such as the butter knife. You could try to kill me with a butter knife, but aside from the relative difficulty you may have in doing this, a butter knife's primary purpose is to butter bread, not to kill people. If you do have a knife designed for killing people you need to be, unlike with a gun, quite close for it to be effective, or be very good at throwing. And even then, you'll only get one shot. Both methods also require a high degree of physical exertion well beyond that required for a gun.
cont'd
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skeek1 year ago
A gun on the other hand, is hardly a multi-purpose instrument. From having seen enough Hollywood movies I can say in all confidence that a gun can be used to, well, open doors, shoot tyres, sink boats, smash windows, get people's attention, and a few other practical uses, but it's first and primary purpose is to kill, or at the very least, maim. It can do this so effortlessly and with such extreme devastation, as has been show by the many, multiple shootings you experience in your nation, that it is clearly the weapon of choice for those with an inclination for such activity. So regardless of what the Chief says, it's much more efficient and effective at doing this than not only knives, but also anyone's bare hands, even Chuck Norris. It is, however, not especially good at buttering bread.
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skeek1 year ago
I see. That would be an American inner city neighbourhood? See, that's the funny thing, I can't help but get the impression that for many, yourself included, your actually a little proud of living and surviving in a violent, gun-crazed society. Or at least it seems that's how you like to portray it when you say things like this.
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skeek1 year ago
Forefathers, forefathers, forefathers. Ancestral worship in America is almost on par with that of the Chinese! It's the 21st century, dear. Wake up and smell the coffee! You have wackos waling onto campuses, into shopping malls and now churches shooting people dead every few days! Lots of people!! What are you going to do about it besides make p*ssweak excuses so you can keep your precious guns?
Oh, and saying that I am international is no cop out. If anything, it's liberating and spares me from feigning loyalty to what amounts to nothing more than irrational, primitive tribalism. Nationalism is fetile ground for fascism.
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ibstilyn1 year ago
Countries and homicide rates per 100,000 population
Jamaica 46.59
Venezuela[22] 42
South Africa 39.5
Colombia[23][24][25][15] 39.3
El Salvador 31.54
Brazil[26] 27
Guatemala 25.47
Russia 19.80
Ecuador 18.33
Kazakhstan 16.33
Bahamas 15.92
Swaziland 13.63
Mexico 13.04
Mongolia 12.81
Paraguay 12.05
Suriname 10.30
Panama 9.56
Argentina 9.47
Lithuania 9.38
Papua New Guinea 9.06
Latvia 8.58
Thailand 8.47
Zimbabwe 8.44
Belarus 8.31
Kyrgyzstan 8.01
Zambia 7.89
Barbados 7.49
Ukraine 7.42
Seychelles 7.39
Uganda 7.37
Estonia 6.82
Moldova 6.71
Sri Lanka 6.69
Namibia 6.35
Costa Rica 6.23
Georgia 6.22
And the USA at 5.9
Gee , what's the gun control laws in Thailand? Pretty strict. Jamaica has some of the strictist gun control on the planet and makes Detroit blush by comparison-again , we have to look at poverty levels , not presence of handguns
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skeek1 year ago
I'm not disputing these figures but I will raise one question.
Aside from the fact that most of these are either third world or developing nations, or nations with varying degrees of political and social instability, other than the USA, you have failed to provide the percentage of murders committed with firearms, and of those, I'd be particularly interested to know just how many of those were from serial shootings. For all I know, most of these could have been committed with Chief's bare hands.
As for Thailand, you may not be aware of this, but Thailand is not only a developing nation that has recently undergone a military coup, but it also has a violent Muslim rebellion in the south, which goes part way to explain its efforts at gun control. But like so many other countries in SE Asia, not to mention most of those on your list, it has a high level of corruption. It's not exactly stable and it does nothing to strengthen your argument by using it as evidence to the contrary.
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tanglang1 year ago
2 million people have died in Africa since the fall of the Soviet Union. This is due to the fact that tribal leaders can get ak's for less than $5. However, even without the guns, they were still killing hundreds of thousands of people. They just used machetes. The problem lies with the people, not the weapons.
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skeek1 year ago
Dear tanglang
Please refer to the comment you are responding to and take careful note of the points I've made regarding the third world and political and social instability, the extreme of which is a war zone similar to what you have just brought up.
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skeek1 year ago
I never said the problems in third world countries are with the people. I'd appreciate if you could show me where I did. The problems of third world countries are many and varied. A lot of it has to do with history, politics, religion, poverty, corruption and other countries screwing them over. The people, if anything, are the victims.
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ibstilyn1 year ago
In the absence of guns, such as in Jamaica and the former soviet states , they simply kill by other means. Guns have no relation to the homicide rate . Pakistan has the lowest homicide rate per 100,000 population & they make AK's by hand in open air bazzars . Kids sleep with AK's under their beds. The oil rich nations like Saudi Arabia are also very low , near pakistani levels. Those nations are homogenous with everyone on the same page so to speak. The melting pot of the US seems to be boiling over in comparison.
You speak of "serial killings"--you are aware that John Wyane Gacy ,Richard Ramirez ,and other mass killers--true "serial" killers never picked up a gun.
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skeek1 year ago
Firstly, no I did not speak of serial killings. You did. My exact words were "serial shootings." You know the ones, you have at least one or two just about every week now in the US. So I think it's pretty clear to the both of us as to what exactly I was talking about, yes? And I don't take kindly to your efforts to twist what I have said to suit your broader argument.
Secondly, you continue to compare the US with unstable, despotic or third world and developing nations, which I had already pointed out in response to your initial comment just doesn't cut the mustard. It suits your argument easily when you draw comparisons with Jamaica, I'm sure, but how about levelling the playing field and look into how the US stacks up against other Western first world nations with regards to 1) serial SHOOTINGS (I obviously need to emphasise this) and 2) gun control.
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skeek1 year ago
As you like stats, these were easily accessible. You'll see the US rates high for murder in the developed world. You'll also see no mention of Jamaica.
"Murder rates vary greatly among countries and societies around the world. In the Western world, murder rates in most countries have declined significantly during the 20th century and are now between 1-4 cases per 100,000 people per year. Murder rates in Japan, Ireland and Iceland are among the lowest in the world, around 0.5; the rate of the United States is among the highest of developed countries, around 5.5 in 2004, with rates in larger cities sometimes over 40 per 100,000."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder
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ibstilyn1 year ago
You fail to see the "despotic third world countries" like Saudi Arabia , Pakistan , Qatar where guns are prevalent and homicide rates are low. In Switzerland they have the Schutzenfest , where most everyone converges on the fairgrounds and ranges. They are highly developed and well armed with low homicide rates. Standard of living and access to mental health goes a long way.You seem to be mincing words. Serial Shootings would infer the same perpetrator on multiple occurances...not unrelated random acts of violence from multiple criminals. If 10 different people run red lights in different towns we do not have serial traffic violations.
The city in the US with the highest murder rate is Washington DC and it has strict gun control. Hawaii is the lowest-also strict gun control. Paradise makes a difference. California & Utah are back to back statistically. One is lenient on guns , the other strict. Both have similar living standards. Poverty feeds crime , not guns.
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Candida1 year ago
tanglang: "You know what our fore-fathers would have done without their guns? Nothing. We would still be a province of GB and would be taxed to death. We would not have any freedoms."
What makes you think so? Australia and Canada are no longer provinces of GB, and they didn't have to fire a single shot for it.
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skeek1 year ago
You asked the question "were they oppressed?" and I answered it. Attention deficit disorder?
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Redneck1 year ago
Australia still suffers under a convict mentality. Why else would they surrend their guns without a whimper but fight for their right to fish without a license? Makes me laugh and then shake my head in wonderment.
Some one has been quoting statistics. When guns were taken in the UK violence crime rose 25%. You make say they have a low homocide rate now but it is still up from what is was. Strong arm daylight breaking and entering is up 30% in two years after the ban on guns!! People did not fear to break in when people were expected to be home and alert!!
The Criminal element's mentality has not changed. However, the ability to defend one's self has. Washington DC has the strictest gun laws in the USA and the highest violent crime rate in the nation! It is crime to have a gun in one's home in DC!! But it does not stop the criminals!! Law biding people are not the problem. Them having guns is not the problem.
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tanglang1 year ago
The population is actually just under that. However, the distance between Kennesaw, Marietta, Roswell and Smyrna is only a few miles. They are all really one big suburb of Atlanta. All of them together have very low crime rates. With a combined pop of 200,000 .
Koreas hit movies are far more violent than ours. So are Chinas. It has nothing to do with movies.
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skeek1 year ago
What violence is found in Korean movies from what I have seen is related to the supernatural. They like their ghost and horror movies. I would disagree also with regards to China's movies being violent. What violence I have seen in them is often stylised, kung fu stuff. When it comes down to the depiction of gun violence in movies, especially in every day settings, you guys win hands down.
But it's not just movies, there's also computer games which require the active participation of the player in violence. I believe these have a desensitising and conditioning effect with regards to violence so that what would ordinarily be disturbing is no longer. I'm not sure of the long-term consequences of this as I've seen Asian kids take to them with a passion while they remain polite and well-mannered, but I believe this is because they have strong values instilled in them through their obligation and commitment to family. They've got something else to teach them right from wrong.
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tanglang1 year ago
I've got over 400 dvds from China and Korea. I tell you what, check out "Old Boy".
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tanglang1 year ago
I'm sorry, but who are you? Have we met? Do I know you? Why not try your hand at debating the facts instead of violating the TOU?
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Candida1 year ago
tanglang: "Take Kennesaw Ga, where I live. We have a law that says you cannot live here without owning a gun. We also have one of the lowest crime rates in the nation. I guess that means nothing to you though."
What is the population of Kennesaw Ga? 25,000? Most cities of that size have practically no violent crime in most countries of the world.
It's not simply gun ownership that leads to violence or safety but the way people think about them, and Americans seem to revere their guns. Just think of the most successful Hollywood movies. Almost all of them involve a lot of shooting.
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MilesAway1 year ago
Tanglang, Tanglang, Tanglang, Tanglang!!!
I am an American and I am damn proud TOO, to be one, but I am not IDIOT like plenty of my fellow countrymen on this forum. Guys, DO EVERYONE A FAVOR, STAY OFF THE NET.
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oldgringo1 year ago
"Read my bio, old fart." Gee, skeek, intelligent AND witty!! You must be an Aussie rocket scientist!!
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ibstilyn1 year ago
Skeek labors under the misconception that "everyone should be like me " -and has a 1 point perspective. If we just did things like them then we'd all have tea & crumpets at 4pm . Not that we don't have those in the US that suffer the same affliction--like we can implant democracy on Iraq and they will all turn into Yankees fans & drink lite beer.
Here we have the right to defend ourselves--in australia that is not a recognized right.If you kill an intruder in Australia you are looking at a murder rap. Here the Supreme court ruled in 2005 that self defense is an individual responsibility--there they feel it's the nanny state that is to provide protection .
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