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Calif. interchange collapses after fire »

Posted by: jeremytoday 1 year, 4 months ago

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An interchange connecting highways to the busy Oakland-San Francisco Bay Bridge collapsed early Sunday after a tractor trailer hauling 8,600 gallons of gasoline caught fire, authorities said.

Read Full Story at news.yahoo.com

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Comments So Far: 84

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Aidenag1 year, 4 months ago

Man they are in for some bad traffic. That junction is pretty vital. Pics from SFchronicle here:
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/c/a...
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harriermech1 year, 4 months ago

So much for fire not melting steel. I guess Rosie and all of the conspiracy theorist nuts are going to say Bush blew it up.
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  SubZero1 year, 4 months ago
  
  Darn it you beat me to the punch line!!!! How many times did we hear?? " Fire can't melt steel".. blah .. blah .. blah..
  I'm with you I think it was all a consiparacy to slow down LA traffic... Those darn republicans they will go to no ends to keep the attention off of Bush...
  Hey was Kennedy any where around??
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    moot511 year, 4 months ago
    
    Let's hope she is gone before she gets the chance.
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    loquaciousrana1 year, 4 months ago
    
    I think you may Bay area traffic since the Bay area bridge links San Fran with Oakland. It more than 300 miles north of LA.
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  Tenric1 year, 4 months ago
  
  The government just REALLY wants you to be late for work I guess.
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  mac19641 year, 4 months ago
  
  It is clear from the video, that the bridge dropped at free-fall speed. A freeway bridge has never in the history of...well freeway bridges, dropped at freefall speeds. Only a freeway bridge in a controlled demolition can drop at freefall speeds.
  Boy, Bush must think we are stupid, this is clearly a vast right wing conspiracy.
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    rockman0691 year, 4 months ago
    
    I don't have a clue as to what you just said. You stated that the video shows a freefall bridge, but then you state there has never been history of such. Then you state only with controlled demolition can you have a freefall. Which is it??? Are you saying there is or isn't freefall?
    And what does that have to do with Bush?
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  Petom11 year, 4 months ago
  
  I once went to a CONCERT that melted. Pretty sure it was the Orange Sunshine.
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    rockman0691 year, 4 months ago
    
    LOL good one! Nice to pick up on that. hehe
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  loquaciousrana1 year, 4 months ago
  
  Actually the jet fuel would have burned out too quick to have melted the steel beams; however, it would have ignited all of the petroleum based office furnishings that would have created an inferno capable of melting the steel girders.
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    pacifex1 year, 4 months ago
    
    Actually, Rosie and her friends are probably right, the steel did not melt.
    What they did not know is that steel will weaken (soften) before melting, and will be weaken significantly that it will only support a small fraction of the weight of solid steel. Therefore the tower will fall and the bridge will fall under the weight of the structure.
    The second tower was hit last, but the first to fall because it was carrying a lot more weight above it. If the towers were destroyed intentionally, the first tower should fall first. It's all logical.
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      rockman0691 year, 4 months ago
      
      No no no, you've got your logic all wrong. Oh wait, you said it right, but libs don't understand logic. It's a conspiracy anyways. :P
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MikeReardon1 year, 4 months ago

The perfect spot to close two major freeways. If it was a smart bomb it could not have done more damage to commuters. The news said Bay Area mass transit is free tomorrow.
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xtaylor0022x1 year, 4 months ago

H O L Y S H I T!
i cant believe that the driver walked out of it, alive! thats insane. well, god bless him with a good healing...2nd degree is pretty rough.
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Bigtone1 year, 4 months ago

Fire doesn't melt steel. Talk about stupid. Where are all the Rosie supporters?
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  HannibalBarca1 year, 4 months ago
  
  Bigfoot:How do you compare apples to fruitcakes such as yourself
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    pacifex1 year, 4 months ago
    
    It takes a fruitcake like you to know an apple
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      rockman0691 year, 4 months ago
      
      lol you guys crack me up!
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tkepner1 year, 4 months ago

Fire Doesn't melt Steel? Gosh, then how do they make it in the first place, if not with fire? According to this Fire Forensic site, http://www.tcforensic.com.au/docs/article10.htm... steel MELTS between 1100-1600 degrees F. This isn't the temp. it gets soft at (the temp. where steel is maleable and deforms) which is lower by a few hundred degrees. And according to this industry standard publication, http://www.mace.manchester.ac.uk/project/resear... & Fire 3557 lo res.pdf,
Temps in fires can reach 1200 degrees F.
Oh, look at that, the two temps cross! Gosh, wouldn't you know it, a gasoline fire CAN soften steel and concrete to the point of failure!
And it took me only an hour find these facts. Looks like the conspiracy-theory people haven't even done a little bit of their homework, they just make up their facts!
Terry - www.tkepner.com - T-shirts, Mugs, Stickers, Buttons, & More... with an Attitude!
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  loquaciousrana1 year, 4 months ago
  
  They are not looking for scientific facts. Anyone with a grade school chemistry education knows that metals like steel are heat conducive. They not only melt, but they also expand/contract with temperature variations. That is one of property characteristics of metals taught in grammar school.
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    Petom11 year, 4 months ago
    
    I worked in a foundry when I was in high school(no child labor laws then) and we not only melted steel with fire but poured molten steel into molds to make all kinds of things. This is called "manufacturing", something that doesn't take place much in this country anymore. No wonder- evidently we have forgotten how to do things like melt steel. Or even make it in the first place.
    "The past is a different country, they do things differently there."
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pacificmist1 year, 4 months ago

I only live about 150 miles north of SF sounds bad.
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innocent-bystander1 year, 4 months ago

To go south from Berkeley to Oakland you have to go out on the Bay Bridge and turn around midspan at Treasure Island.
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MikeReardon1 year, 4 months ago

San Francisco 11 pm KGO 7 News fire department said it took 21 min. for the fire to take down the steel in the freeway. They did the comparison to the World Trade Center fires.
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NoWayMan1 year, 4 months ago

I'm no rosie fan, and I don't have a degree in metallurgy, but I see alot of people on here saying that this fire melted the steel beams.
now, the only story I've seen so far on this (the same story thats reprinted on every news site it seems) is from the AP. and in that story it doesn't say the metal beams were melted.
it says:
Witnesses reported flames rising up to 200 feet into the air. Heat exceeded 2,750 degrees and caused the steel beams holding up the interchange from eastbound I-80 to eastbound Interstate 580 above to buckle and bolts holding the structure together to melt, leading to the collapse, California Department of Transportation director Will Kempton said.
so the steel beams didn't melt according to Will Kempton. what melted were the bolts that held the beams together, which caused the structure to collapse.
just FYI.
and thank god no one was killed.

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  zaph221 year, 4 months ago
  
  and what were those bolts made out of? And the steel did buckle, what do you think caused that? Them being afraid of fire? LMAO, even when it happens and there is no denying it, it gets denied. Everyone that still believes fire won't melt steel really needs to visit a steel mill.
  and was it really an accident you left this out, or didn't you read the whole story... "The fire melted a second interchange from eastbound I-80 to eastbound I-580 located above the first interchange, causing a 250-yard section of the roadway to collapse onto the roadway below, according to the highway patrol"
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Tenric1 year, 4 months ago

Uh, there's more than just "libs" that use that road you moron.
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  decipher1 year, 4 months ago
  
  nope, aparently everyone in california is stupid, little and liberal.
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SlapALib1 year, 4 months ago

I've never seen an interchange collapse due to fire. Where's the thermite?
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vidman041 year, 4 months ago

What, no comments from Rosie or the other truther nuts? Must be in a meeting trying to come up with a way to blame Bush.....
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joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago

Well, here's a couple of comments (I'm not a Rosie nut, but anyway...): GASOLINE, not jet fuel, and it was burning in the open with plenty of Oxygen available instead of in an enclosed area starved for oxygen. It does raise some interesting questions though, doesn't it? Anybody know if they use the same grade of steel for highway construction that they use for putting up skyscrapers?
Oh, and yes, of course fire melts steel, but if you visit a steel mill, you WILL NOT find them using gasoline - or jet fuel - to fire the furnaces. They don't burn hot enough. They use coke (NOT the cola, duh.) and force in air to get the temperature up. Last I heard, anyway.
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  joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
  
  Any enclosed area will limit oxygen supply to a combustion process. Particularly one burning vigorously. This is evidenced by the emission of black smoke - which are unburned (or partially burned) hydrocarbons.
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    zaph221 year, 4 months ago
    
    "Any enclosed area will limit oxygen supply to a combustion process. Particularly one burning vigorously. This is evidenced by the emission of black smoke - which are unburned (or partially burned) hydrocarbons."
    So why does any buliding, house, ever have a fire start inside of it then? And even an electrical fire would go out right away if since it would need oxygen to spread so that can't be it... I mean with your theory of limited oxygen inside bulidings...
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      joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
      
      "limits" is NOT the same thing as "excludes."
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        zaph221 year, 4 months ago
        
        well if you know about steel mills, and how steel is made, and melted, you might realize in the blast furnaces, where is it melted, it's enclosed, with all the gases pumped in, kind of like, oh, a big buliding, and yet in the entirely enclosed environment, the metal is melted then when it's released, into the air, it cools quickly into... hardened steel. And when it needs to be transported in a liquid form, it's put in to brick lined rail transport cars, look kind of like a submerine on rail wheels, and then it's closed to keep the metal HOT. And we do know there was enough oxygen in those bulidings to get the fires started and spreading don't we? again, nice try at distraction.
        I'm just glad that there weren't a lot of injuries, and I'm glad I don't live in that area, I feel bad for the people that have to deal with the effect all that steel that can't melt, melting and the traffic problems it's going to cause them.
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        joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
        
        Sort of like a big building. It's hard to know for sure what dynamics occurred at the WTC (I Assume that's what you refer to.) In theory, if there had been no obstruction between floors, I'd have expected a significant chimney effect. The heat rising from the burn site through the top of the building would have drawn more air in through the bottom and kept the fire well oxygenated. However. There is significant obstruction to the flow of air inside a building. I'd imagine the very best airways would be the elevator shafts and stairways. At least until obstructed by the elevator car - and assuming the stairway doors were open to admit the air at the bottom. Is that what happened? Don't know. Where were the elevators? Don't know. How much air COULD have been sucked in through the lower floor openings? Don't know. What we DID see was a lot of black smoke - which indicates an insufficiently oxygenated fire. Conclusions? Hard to say - the evidence is gone.
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        zaph221 year, 4 months ago
        
        I think you can also assume when the planes went into the buildings they didn't just take out big seconds of the outside wall, but also some of the flooring seperating the floors, I mean how could they not? and at the speed they went in there is a good chance of fuel ending up in the elevator shafts.
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        loquaciousrana1 year, 4 months ago
        
        One mistaken conclusion is that the fire had to get hot enough to completely melt the steel beams. Steel girders in buildings are connected the same way steel girders in bridges are connected. The fire would only have had to gotten hot enough to cause the girders to buckle. The weight of the building would have shifted creating even more pressure on the weakened girders leading to their failure. Steel girders in highrise buildings are tied off just like steel girders for bridges. If a fire could melt the bolts tying off the bridges girders, it could also melt the bolts tying of the highrise's girders. As far as evidence goes, there would have been ample evidence as the site to determine the cause of the collapse. The fire would not have vaporized the metal girders.
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  joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
  
  "easily" - I'm not sure that's the right word. "possibly" under some circumstances - maybe. Try this: take a can of gasoline (not inside your house), put a steel bar over the top of it, and set it on fire. Does the steel melt? Wait awhile. How about now? Wait some more. Now? I'll bet dollars to donuts you will NEVER see a steel bar melt under those conditions. Probably won't even get red-hot. It takes a highly concentrated, well oxygenated flame of that sort to melt steel. OR - maybe a tanker full of gasoline in an open-air burn. DO NOT mistake me for a liberal knucklehead - just pointing out a couple of things for those who dropped out of high school.
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    zaph221 year, 4 months ago
    
    you mean like blacksmiths do?
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      joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
      
      Blacksmiths don't use gasoline. They use(d) charcoal or coke - maybe coal or wood - but you will recall a bellows arrangement to force-feed oxygen to the fire? Just a free-burning fire wouldn't be hot enough - it had to be fanned. And, the fire pit was enclosed to a degree to concentrate the heat.
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        zaph221 year, 4 months ago
        
        the pit being enclosed, limiting fuel for the fire, was exactly my point. and yes, I do remember the bellows, to force air into the fire, rather like the ventilation system in buildings...
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        loquaciousrana1 year, 4 months ago
        
        Actually, your experiment would not have duplicated the situation. One your ratios are off. Two you would have to have accounted for the gravitational forces being applied to the steel girders. The girders have to hold up the weight of the structure which is constantly being pulled toward the Earth's center. Your steel bar is too thick to represent the proper ratio.
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        joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
        
        Tinker your bar size any way you like. Long as it isn't thin as tissue paper it won't melt. Gravity has nothing to do with melting point, it would only cause the material to deform. I've been passing right by a highway overpass construction site for some months now. The steel beams being used are in the neighborhood of 2 1/2 feet deep and pretty thick. Aside from intrinsic heat resistance, there would doubtless be a good deal of heat dissipation due to conductance. All the concrete in place around and along the steel would serve to stiffen the structure and serve as additional heat sink - in addition to increasing the load. All this means is that the fire in California was putting out a LOT of heat. Guess you might expect that from a tanker full. Kind of makes you wonder: What would have been the result if this had occurred ON the bridge? Talk about a freaking disaster.
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    joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
    
    Lefty? YOU must be stupid. I have not EVER stated nor concluded that the fire from that tanker load of gasoline didn't cause the bridge collapse. Man, point out a couple of things and everyone ASSumes you are a lefty trying to PROVE something totally unrelated and starts labeling and name-calling. Give it a rest, wouldja?
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    Tenric1 year, 4 months ago
    
    haha dollars to donuts. I can't belive you used that phrase.
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      joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
      
      Price of donuts these days, those aren't really big odds...{8>D)=
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    bill29361 year, 4 months ago
    
    Your experioment forgot to add a few tons of extra weight to the steel bar then setting the fire, called Ductile Failure.
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  zaph221 year, 4 months ago
  
  I worked in a steel mill, in a blast furnace dept. to pay for college, I know how it works, I also know there was plenty of oxygen in those bulldings, I think they needed it so all those people working in them could breathe, and then there were huge holes in the towers letting more air in. Besides all that, I don't remember Rosie saying anything about what fueled a fire causing it to melt or not melt, I believe what she said was "for the first time in history fire melted steel" clearly she didn't care what the fuel was, only wanted us all to know that no fire has ever melted steel. But once again, great lib try at distraction from the real issue at hand.
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    joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
    
    I don't think anyone doubts that Rosie is an idiot...
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jumpmaster1 year, 4 months ago

I thought the bridge collapsed after a team of conspirators worked all week undetected planting shaped charges with remote control detonation.
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vor1 year, 4 months ago

While you lunatics are talking about nothing but 9/11. This really shows the coming issues we have with our continued lack of investment in our infrastructure. An issue that will continue to be ignored as we pour coffers of borrowed money down the drain in Iraq.

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  joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
  
  I don't see how having a carload of cops on hand would prevent something like this anyway. It does seem odd that this catastrophic event just HAPPENED to occur right at a very busy critical intersection. A suspicious person MIGHT start to think it was deliberate. Perhaps even just a little test to see what might happen? Of course, with the price of gas what it is, there MUST be cheaper ways to bomb something. Cripes, if you knew where to shop, you could probably get a nuke cheaper than a tanker full of gas...{8>D)=
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    Tenric1 year, 4 months ago
    
    I think the real problem is A) Design interchanges so one small disaster doesn't f the whole system up B) Do everything you can to encourage public transportation. But of course both of these things will never work.
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      joeblowe1 year, 4 months ago
      
      This seems sensible. Unfortunately the roads are already built and re-configuring is MAJOR headache - and expensive. Public transportation is good - in theory, but it doesn't have anything to do with the commercial transportation industry. Personally, I'd love to be able to take public trans. I used to do it. Now, I don't live near a train station. Take a bus, then a train, then a cab or another bus? No thanks.
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  vor1 year, 4 months ago
  
  DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHAT INFRASTRUCTURE IS?
  Where is there anything about homeland security in my post? I am talking about the physical condition of our infrastructure but I am going to make you look that word up.
  And I am the moron? You blow my mind man.
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  vidman041 year, 4 months ago
  
  The only problem with that V.O.R., is the California highway system is a state issue, doesn't have anything to do with Federal government policies overseas....
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    vor1 year, 4 months ago
    
    I assume this interchange is directly connected to the US Interstate system. If that is the case our foreign policy is linked. I get the feeling that when we walk away from Iraq we will have essentially p-ssed away a trillion dollars. Terrorism up 26% and we will have gained little.
    Estimates to bring our infrastructure up to date range between 1-3 Trillion. You don't seriously think Iraq doesn't affect the ability to budget that money? Do you? Congress wont even go there for fear of the expense. Something we should not be postponing. The sun is up, take your blinders off please.
    
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evelyna1 year, 4 months ago

Did the driver blow it up himself? This rarely happens.
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  Tenric1 year, 4 months ago
  
  I'm surprised this hasn't happened before. My dad is a trucker and we've watched other trucks do all kinds of stupid stuff when I've gone on the road with him. (Longer hours on the road means you get to see ALL the good stuff). I've also gotten to see the boneyards where they keep all the wrecked trucks. Now, that's some scary stuff.
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ListenUP1 year, 4 months ago

Looks like a job for Haliburton. (looks like a job BY Haliburton!)
BTW, For those of you who THINK Rosie was fired, WRONG. She quit, to pursue a career in Metalurgical Engineering and Hoho Taste Tester.
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  jumpmaster1 year, 4 months ago
  
  LOL!
  Hostess had better institute a quantity control process with her. She could put them out of business if they turn their backs on her.
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decipher1 year, 4 months ago

i can't believe that some of you (slappy, libssuck et al) missed this. the truck was hauling gasoline.... where does gasoline come from? oil. where does oil come from? you know where it comes from. this was obviously an islamoterriorist act and you guys missed your chance rub our liberal noses in it.
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  SlapALib1 year, 4 months ago
  
  It was obviously a PNAC plot to take the heat off the WTC collapse story, decipher. Get with it.
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  jumpmaster1 year, 4 months ago
  
  "islamoterriorist act"
  What the heck?
  There are medications that may help with this condition.
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kriicket1 year, 4 months ago

First it was moo moo, now its HoHo taste tester...these get better and better....gives me a good chuckle.
Anyway.......sounds like traffic for the people in the area are going to have it rough for a while. Sure am glad the truck driver didn't sustain worse injuries. Hope his recovery is speedy.
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  eviln3d1 year, 4 months ago
  
  Considering the truck driver was speeding and caused this problem I'm sure he'll find himself with so many lawsuits he'll wish he was dead.
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innocent-bystander1 year, 4 months ago

I'm no expert but I'll take a look. It's 5 minutes from work. It is in the perfect spot where two freeways, north- south and east-west, meet before the Bay Bridge approach. It is in the right spot to cause massive problems. If the beams are not melted the driver must be a mossad/CIA agent trying to aggitate Berkeley leftists, Mayor Newsome and President Pelosi. If the beams are melted I know I'm after a gas station video of an anomaly that I can say is an Exocet missile.
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  jumpmaster1 year, 4 months ago
  
  "trying to aggitate Berkeley leftists"
  This alone is worth the price of admission.
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    rockman0691 year, 4 months ago
    
    You never know, maybe there is trace evidence of some unidentified powder that may resemble an explosive substance. The drive was on crack, but that can also be construed as a terrorist behind the wheel.
    Never know.......
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aceofspades11 year, 4 months ago

After seeing months of postings by those who call themselves "truthers" denying scientific fact as to the effect of heat upon building materials, I have come to the realisation that no amount of actual fact & reasoning will change their misguided beliefs. So to them the only answer I have is - YOU ARE A BUNCH OF NEANDERTHAL IDIOTS
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  rockman0691 year, 4 months ago
  
  At least you recognize the fact, both the first and the last.
  Oh snap! could he be talking about me????
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aceofspades11 year, 4 months ago

Tenric - I'm surprised this hasn't happened before--
It has -several times in NY - a couple of years ago a tanker caught fire under an overpass of the NY Thruway
the overhead structure & roadway collapsed
Last spring on Rte 7 in Ridgefield Ct a tanker caught fire on a small bridge over the Norwalk River - people I know who were there said it sounded like a large bomb going off & it caused a smoke flume reminiscent of 9/11 but on a smaller scale- We must use steel with a lot of wood in it here on the East coast - because those bridges somehow collapsed just from the heat of the fire.

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  eviln3d1 year, 4 months ago
  
  I think its the result of older bridges when steel was more impure and the greater number of mafia families and shady contractors in the North East... just look at the Big Dig for a shining example of Yankee quality.
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eviln3d1 year, 4 months ago

Truth is... The 9/11 truth seekers were getting close so very close to the truth that the Black Ops needed to stop further digging at the truth... First they convinced Rosie that she was way to good for ABC so she would leave The View (sources in side Black Ops squad 2 said they were tempted to offer her a life times supply of ice cream but were afraid it would cost to much) - it didn't matter Rosie was gone. Now Black Ops Squad 1 was set to initiate project Crossroads. They waited for a tanker truck then quickly shot out its tires with frozen water bullets to avoid detection. As the truck sat burning a crew of men set about thermite charges to bring down the roadway. The original target was supposed to have been an intersection in Orlando that would have used Bush's brother as a helper, but as people enjoy Disney World they decided to do it on a roadway in a city at odds with the President.
And if you believe this, I might be willing to sell you shares in my siberian timshare.
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  SlapALib1 year, 4 months ago
  
  We all knew that was a load of crap, eviln3d. Everyone knows if a black ops team was involved in taking out Rosie they would have had her break her neck on a flight of stairs by way of a Ho-Ho lure.
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    eviln3d1 year, 4 months ago
    
    The plan for her to break her neck was scrapped when it was discovered that she hadn't set foot on a stair at least 100 pounds ago.
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      rockman0691 year, 4 months ago
      
      Stop you guys, my sides hurt!
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aceofspades11 year, 4 months ago

eviln - I don't know why I'm even bothering to respond to
your nonsense --- so I won't
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